Interview with Matthew Gallery, Boston University Assistant Director of Admissions

We had the privilege of having Matthew Gallery, Boston University Assistant Director of Admissions, join us in a webinar Q&A a few weeks ago to talk about the upcoming changes to admissions and the unique challenges of higher education in the years ahead.

Elton Lin: I’m excited to have everyone with us, and I’m excited to have our special guest with us as well. My name is Elton Lin; I’m the founder and CEO of ILUMIN Education, and I’m excited to continue our webinar series with a host of different counselors and representatives from all the United States, and to continue that series with Mathew Gallery, who is the assistant director of admissions from Boston University. I’m really excited to have him on. I’ve really enjoyed speaking with him, and his excitement for the admissions process is just terrific, welcoming students, helping students find the right fit for a school, really just appreciating this entire process for students. So I’m really excited to have Matthew with us. Thank you so much for coming!

Mathew Gallery: Thank you so much for having me. And good afternoon everyone!

Elton Lin: All right, so why don’t we go ahead and get into our questions. Matthew, if you don’t mind telling us a little bit about your role at BU, and perhaps your story about how you got into admissions. 

Mathew Gallery: Yeah, certainly. When I went to college, I actually had a very unique track. When I was “searching” through colleges, I just visited one school, and that happened to be because I went with a friend who was touring. When it came to applying to college, I applied to one college, I got admitted to one college, and I went to one college. So the college admissions process, and the college search, was just never something I considered, even as I went through college. It wasn’t really until my senior year, when one of my friends happened to be an admissions representative as an undergraduate student, and she kind of pulled me into the idea of volunteering, to be able to give back to high school students as they went through the college search. It really wasn’t until then that I learned what college admissions really was. It was something I sought out post-graduation, and something I fell in love with, because now I get to go and help folks as they go through their college search. Having been first-gen myself, I know that there are so many questions that folks may not know to ask, and how to portray that information. And it’s really great to be able to share info on the school that I love, but also not feel like it’s salesy. My job is never to sell you, or tell you to go to this school; it’s to share information to help you figure out if it’s a good fit.

So that’s a little about how I got into admissions, and in the world of admissions itself, I’ve had the opportunity to branch out, and actually I get to oversee some of our undergraduate students on campus who help with the admissions process. For folks who see an admissions presentation, in-person usually but of course online right now, we as professional staff members always speak alongside current undergraduate students, and I help oversee those students. I help them give back to folks as they go through the college search. So it’s a nice loop that I kind of put myself into. 

Elton Lin:  I always wonder, because I didn’t apply to that many colleges, but when you started going through the process of joining the admissions office, did you ever think, “Hey, I wish I’d looked at more schools”? Or, perhaps, wished you’d gone somewhere else?

Matthew Gallery: I would say, there’s good and bad to having too many options. You want to be sure that you’re finding a college that’s a god fit for you. And I did that. I don’t wish that I’d gone anywhere else, but there’s something to be said in being exposed to different kinds of schools. Not necessarily as many schools as possible, but at least branching out to see different types: large schools versus small schools, schools that have lots of majors versus more specific, schools that have a very urban feel versus, well, a traditional college campus, if you will. Being able to see these different environments can really help shape where students see themselves as well.

Elton Lin: So why don’t we jump into what’s been happening. 2020 has been a topsy-turvy year, to say the least. What’s been the biggest change for you and your colleagues during this time? 

Matthew Gallery: I’d say that there are traditional struggles that everyone is going through, trying to adapt to this new way of life, like this Zoom fatigue, of just having Zoom 24/7. And our challenge is that we’re still trying to do our best to share campus life, the community, student life… and to really capture that in an entirely digital setting. We want students to be able to really “experience” the campus. So how do we capture that? How do we help them do the college search, when everyone’s looking at a computer right now?

So our biggest challenge is trying to share that, and do it justice: what campus is like, what our students are like, what our community is like. But also keeping it authentic: that this will be your future if you choose BU, or elsewhere.

Elton Lin: Let’s jump into some of the practicals of transitioning for this coming fall. What does this hybrid process even look like for you?

Matthew Gallery: Boston University adopted, pretty early on, a program called – with trademarks – Learn From Anywhere. The idea behind this is – just like you said – it’s a hybrid model where students can choose if they’re going to learn in-person, or they’re going to learn remotely. They can choose whether they’re going to live on campus, or off campus, or stay where they are. We thought that was a really important thing to offer students, because they really come from anywhere. California’s the third most represented state on campus, so they really come from all across the U.S. And a quarter of our students are international as well. And even getting visas to come to campus, or even if it’s just flying across the country, or even from a couple states away, there’s the issue of quarantining…

We wanted to be sure we were prepared for any scenario – and I think we’ve done a pretty good job. Every single one of our classes is going to have an online option, even classes that are only eight students large. And students don’t have to pre-plan. If they wake up that day, and they’d rather take class online, they have that option, just to make sure students feel safe.

Then the flip side is, we wanted to make sure we were transparent about this entire process. We sent a communication out: “We’re not sure what is happening, but here’s what we’re doing with the information that we do have.” Learn From Anywhere has been a really great – I don't want to say “solution,” but I’ll say “approach” – to what has been going on.

Elton Lin: I imagine it was quite an orchestration to say that every single class is both online and in-person, and students can choose.

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely. I know they’ve been equipping each classroom, all summer, to make sure it’s set up in the best way possible. 

Elton Lin: But what it does do is, opposed to some schools that are going only online, and, thereby, by U.S. immigration law, disallowing first-year international students to come – and since you guys have 24% international, that’s substantial – giving the option to come to school, and thereby start the real university experience, is important.

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely.

Elton Lin: Okay, I want to jump into the admissions process. Can you give the audience an inside look at what happens once it lands in your office?

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely. So we’re looking for students to be a strong academic fit and a strong community fit when it comes to BU. We will be test-optional for this coming year, for the SAT and ACT, and that’s for every one of our programs, even our seven-year accelerated medicine program, which typically requires subject tests alongside the SAT and ACT. When we delve into the transcript, we have two lenses we’re looking at it with. The first is overall performance – which includes cumulative GPA, of course, but we also look at things like trends and performance in individual classes. Context is always important. For example, in this past semester, many students are going to have pass/fail or credit/no credit. And for students that didn’t do that, we understand that grades might not be reflective of what they could have been, or might have been in the past.

We also take into account academic rigor: which classes the student selected in the context of the school they’re coming from. As the Northern California representative, it’s my job to make sure I understand different curricula. For example, there’s a school in San Francisco that did away with the social sciences in the last few years. It’s understanding the nuances of the schools that they’re coming from, and understanding how that affects the classes that they take and the opportunities that they have.

So here’s what we do at BU when an application lands on our desk. We have a first set of eyes, which is usually the person who’s the representative for that region. So, for me, I understand the student’s school. And then I move it on to a committee, and it goes through the committee’s process. We also have the community review. That’s looking at everything – like extra-curriculars, but I don’t like that word. I want to break that down and say it’s not just sports or clubs or organizations. It’s everything from family responsibilities to jobs that students had to community service to research to internships. It’s so many different pieces – basically, what’s that student doing after that last bell rings at school? We try to understand their involvement in the community, either in school or out of it.

The essay is a great platform for students to be able to share more about themselves. We do have two essays that are required for all students. The first is the Common Application essay, which is where we want them to tell us more about themselves. And then we do have a Boston University specific essay – “essay,” really; it’s a max of 250 words two paragraphs, on why BU could be a good fit. I see it as a chance for students to detail where are they coming from, and where are they going? So, between those two pieces, we want students to be a strong fit, to see that they can really go above and beyond, once they come to BU: that they’ll do well in the classroom, but that they’ll also get involved outside the classroom, in our clubs and organizations, in our internships, in our research opportunities, in our study abroad.

Elton Lin: Maybe this is a common question, but as the Northern California representative, you must get, sometimes, a student, say, from San Francisco, and maybe another from somewhere like Cupertino. Are you comparing those two students, or do you look at everyone individually?

Matthew Gallery: It’s context, really. Our applicant pool is so large that we want to make sure we’re just accounting for students within their own context. That’s why we try to break it down into different high schools. We try not to compare students against each other, both within the schools, and across schools. The contextual piece of understanding schools is so that we can give students the benefit of the school they’re coming from, understanding nuances in their curricula and such.

Elton Lin: Got it. Now here’s another question that probably comes up all the time, but since it’s the inaugural year that many schools are going test optional… Is it really test optional? If they didn’t send the scores, do you assume they didn’t do well on the test? 

Matthew Gallery: It’s going to be our first year not reviewing tests, but I really think it is going to be test optional. And I can say that confidently, especially because there’s been very limited access to SAT’s and ACT’s. When we made the change, early in the summer, we had a guess that so many students would still submit tests. But as it’s getting further and further into the summer, it’s looking like a vast majority of our students will not have tests, through no fault of their own.

We really want to make sure we’re giving students the best review possible, and the way we’re going to do that without tests is focusing more on the transcript. We’re going to focus more on the essays and the supplemental questions. And we know that both the Common Application and coalition application are going to have supplemental questions that relate to COVID-19. Again, that context is so important, but we’re just going to be diving deeper into it than we already do.

Elton Lin: So what I hear you saying is that if a student doesn’t submit a test, it’s not so much that you’re second-guessing whether they didn’t actually do so well, because you don’t know if they had access to it. So if they don’t submit it, you don’t review it. If they submit it, you review it.

Matthew Gallery: That’s correct.

Elton Lin: That’s good to know. Because that comes up in all of these conversations, and it may come up again! So, moving on – if you can answer this – what does a viable applicant for BU look like? Common questions are like, when you talk about transcripts, what does a good transcript look like? Or, what type of students are you looking for? Who is a good fit for BU?

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely. I’ve actually had the pleasure of being on several summer workgroups, and we’re trying to boil it down, to be as transparent as possible. We have internal ways that we’ve been able to identify strong candidates who are going to be exemplary within the BU community, but we’re trying to identify maybe five or ten keywords, so that you get an insight into what we’re looking for.

In terms of the transcript, there are a lot of numbers out there. The average GPA last year was about a 3.8, unweighted on a 4.0 scale. We do use unweighted GPA, because we do have that analysis of the classes’ rigor. And we look at five subject areas: mathematics, social sciences, laboratory sciences, English, and foreign languages. There are no hard rules to what we look at, with a few exceptions. If someone applies to the school of business of the school of engineering, we do require calculus for both of those programs, and for our college of health and rehabilitation we require pre-calculus. Other than that, we’re just looking at whether the students challenged themselves, again, in their context.

But the tough part of identifying who’s going to be a strong candidate for BU is that there really is no prototype for a BU student. It’s not like we’re looking for the student who’s had the most research opportunities, or the student who’s played the most sports. We try to get them all. But in terms of some characteristics that we do hold in high regard – and this isn’t a be-all end-all, it’s not like, if a student doesn’t fit this, they’re not going to get in – is leadership. That’s a cliché term. And yes, it’s the president. Yes, it’s the captain. But leadership is also advocacy. It’s social justice. It’s being a representative within the community. These are the sorts of things that we identify as leadership, and love to see on our campus, because it means that students are not just going to take the lead, but promote people in a community.

Also, a level of self-awareness. Emotional intelligence. Being aware of your strengths and weaknesses. Being aware of where you can grow, and who you are within your greater community. That shows us that a student really is mature, and that they’re looking to go outside their comfort zone, to grow. Little things like that can go a long way. 

Elton Lin: It’s interesting, because the leadership conversation comes up a lot. Some parents will say, “Well, my son or daughter isn’t the captain of the football team.” Or maybe, as a student out there in the audience, you’re thinking, “I’m more shy, I’m introverted.” And they almost feel like they’re coming at a disadvantage with regards to leadership. What are your thoughts on that?

Matthew Galley: I really try to emphasize, as much as possible, that it’s not just the titles. It’s not just outside or peer-to-peer recognition of “leadership” in the traditional role. It’s also having the personality of trying to advocate for others. Standing up for something. Or donating time – that’s something that we see as what leaders do. They give back to the community – which can sometimes show through things like community service. So leadership is so much more than just president or captain of a club or organization. It’s so much past that. And I really try to emphasize that everywhere I go.

Elton Lin: Right. Now, migrating on to essays… I’ve been talking to a lot of admissions people, and the big joke is that they’re going to be reading a lot of COVID-19 essays. But what are essays that you like reading? I’m sure that you read the same subjects and themes all the time, but what are some of the things that you like reading?

Matthew Gallery: In terms of – well, like you said about COVID – but even in terms of other trends, there’s a couple of ways to go about it. There’s not one topic that’s necessarily better than another. But it’s that self-reflection, taking a look within, describing yourself, your personality, your character, your beliefs. When that sort of information shines through an essay, that’s what makes it enjoyable, because it allows for me to get to know my applicants better. It gives me insight into how they think and how they operate. And that shows me a little bit of who they would be in our community.

So even if it’s about COVID, or – I can’t count how many people write about having a torn ACL, or were cut from a certain team. These things are difficult. But if they just write about how much they stunk, that’s not going to make for a great essay. But when they talk about how they were then able to give back to the team – they took on a sideline role to be able to support their teammates, and learned about being a team player – those are the sorts of things we enjoy.

Let your personality shine through. If you’re funny, be funny. If you’re serious, be serious. If you’re a poet, write something that’s going to sound beautiful. And if you’re not, that’s totally okay as well. We’re not looking for you to make the next great American novel. We’re just looking to learn a bit more about you.

Elton Lin: Let me ask you, with regards to your process, how important is the essay in the process?

Matthew Gallery: The essay is really the last place that students have agency within the application. What I mean by that is that, as a student, your grades are what they are. In terms of involvement, you’ve done so many things so far. But this is the last thing, as you go through the application process, that you get to leave us with. It’s the most recent in your brain, what you’re thinking about currently. So it’s very valuable within our application process because it gives us that insight into who you are, and your background. And, frankly, it gives us a heads up if you’re paying attention to detail – because if you misspell some things, or forget to switch out the name of the college that you’re applying to, which is more common than it probably should be – those are the sorts of details that you could quickly pay attention to.

Elton Lin: So, if all of the sudden it becomes about U Penn, is it automatically a turn off?

Matthew Gallery: It’s not automatically out the window, but…

Elton Lin: It’s not good.

Matthew Gallery: I may not want to go to bat for you as much.

Elton Lin: Got you. So, coming back to the admissions process as a whole, and especially in light of things like test-optional, and pass/fail or no grades for most students, how is the process going to change for this coming fall?

Matthew Gallery: We’ve always – at least for the past ten years – required senior grades for our applicants. So we’re going to rely heavily on senior grades, assuming that a student’s going to have a physical grade: A, B, C, or a GPA, like 3.0, whatever it may be. But we’re also going to rely pretty heavily on that contextual piece we talked about – the COVID essay, and the COVID questions. We’re going to rely on the recommendations, and the extra pieces of information there. It’ll give us more context in terms of extra challenges a student has faced, It’s going to help us identify students who – even if they had pass/fail or the senior grades weren’t indicative – were able to bounce back and are still preparing themselves.

Now, there’s going to be the challenge that we’re still dealing with COVID – and if I were a betting man, I’d say that we’re going to be dealing with COVID for quite some time. That’s also going to affect clubs and organizations. It’s going to affect students’ ability to be involved within the community. So we welcome students telling us what they’ve been doing, whether it’s online or just personal interests, but we also welcome them telling us what they would have been doing, plans that they had, whether it’s a summer program or an internship, or things that they were going to be doing this fall. You’re welcome to share that with us. Because that is something that would have been part of your application, and now can’t be, and that’s out of your control.

That was a long way of saying that context has always been a huge part of our application review, and it’s going to be even more so this coming year.

Elton Lin: So a big thing is for the students to give you as clear a view of themselves as they can, so that you can really understand their situation. Because, again, it’s not the students’ fault that they can’t access certain activities, or do what they’d planned to do. But you don’t automatically know that, until they tell you, is that correct?

Matthew Gallery: Right, that’s correct.

Elton Lin: What about early decision? So you’d mentioned that you’re going to look more at first semester senior grades, which totally makes sense, but with regards to early decision, how might that change for this coming year?

Matthew Gallery: We typically look at progress reports. We have good relationships with the school counselors to be able to ask, even if it’s unofficial. We just want an inkling of what’s going on in a student’s senior year, and make sure that things are relatively consistent to what they’ve been. Consistency’s a big part of what we’re looking for senior year. Often it’s not a full year, but just half a year, or even a first quarter. We may have a small sample size of classes. So we’re just looking to make sure students don’t get “senioritis,” for lack of a better way to phrase it: that they’re keeping up their studies in their senior year, that they’ve taken all the courses they said they were going to take. That’s the piece we’re looking for when we request senior grades. 

Elton Lin: Got it. Now, moving on, families and students both have their own ideas of what the admissions process is like. What do you think is the most misunderstood part of it?

Matthew Gallery: It really is a holistic review. There is no cutoff point, where if a student is below this test score, they don’t have a chance. It’s going to be a little bit more challenging, certainly, if they’re below some of our averages, but that’s not to say that students don’t have those chances. There’s something I really like about our early decision pool. Even if we’re unable to offer early admission, 95% of those students are given an option for regular decision. Because we understand that new information may come in. Context may be added. We don’t want to deny students up front because we want to give them as many chances as possible as they go through the application process. So a holistic review really is a big part of our process. There’s really no one piece that we’re focusing on.

To provide some examples: take the curriculum review. If I have a student in front of me who has a 4.0 GPA, but hasn’t taken any competitive classes, and those are offered at their school, that student’s chance of being admitted to BU is probably not as good as it would be. We want our students to challenge themselves, and be ready for the rigors of college life. Same with involvement. If I have a student who has a 4.0 GPA and has taken rigorous classes, but has literally done nothing – they list as their activities that they watch Netflix all day, not that someone would actually write that! We want students to be involved, because we expect that that’ll continue when they come to BU. We want students who will get involved and stay involved. Those are the type of students who might be a better fit for BU, so it’s something that we value within the application.

Elton Lin: Got it. And last thing before we go into our Q&A: there are still some students figuring out what their school list is going to look like for the fall, and which schools they’re going to apply to. Invariably, someone listening in right now is thinking about applying to BU. What can you share about BU that’ll help them understand whether they are a good fit for it? 

Matthew Gallery: BU is such a balance of different things. It’s a place where you truly get to explore different academics. We have 300 programs of study, and none of our programs are impacted. 

Elton Lin: Not even computer science? 

Matthew Gallery: Not even computer science. We are currently building – it’s going to be our tallest building on campus – a new computer science building. Construction’s already started, and it’s going to be available in the fall of 2021. So there are no impacted majors, including business, engineering, computer science… That’s all available to our students. And we’re very transparent – we publish what you need to switch between majors. If you’re looking to switch into business, it tells you which two classes you need.

And a part of our curriculum is actually taking classes in different schools and colleges. Our general curriculum is called the BU Hub, and what’s interesting about it is that it’s not just about checking off boxes, like English 101, Math 101, Science 101. Rather than have every single student take a first-year English class, where you study Shakespeare – though we do offer plenty of that, if that’s your interest – we also offer English through the history of Boston. We offer English through studying the history of baseball.  There’s one about the ethics of superheroes.

There are really interesting ways to learn these valuable skills. Because reading and writing is valuable, regardless of the program you’re studying. But we do it in ways that are going to be interesting to you, and we offer classes that are going to be more relevant to your major. And we have thousands and thousands of classes in the BU Hub. We want to make sure that you’re learning these essential skills, things like historical consciousness, global citizenship… It’s so much more than just critical thinking.

Elton Lin: What you’re saying is that in BU, there are a lot of ways to customize, and there’s an expectation to explore different disciplines. You don’t want them sitting in a computer lab the entire duration of their college career. Is that correct? 

Matthew Gallery: Correct. Undeclared is our most popular point of entry. There’s no pressure to even have a major when you apply. And 75% of our students have a second form of study, whether it’s a double major or at least a minor. And that can be across multiple colleges. So it’s really part of the BU experience, to explore outside your major.

Elton Lin: And just for some clarity on what you said earlier about transferring majors. Certainly a lot of students have an idea of what they want to do, and then change their mind. So if I wanted to study economics at the outset, and then I wanted to change to computer science, is that a complicated or difficult process?

Matthew Gallery: I’m actually going to send a link to our chat, our intra-university transfer. We fully publicize which courses are required to switch between schools and colleges. So, in your example, if you’re trying to switch to computer science, within our college of arts and sciences, there are actually no restrictions. It’s completely available to all undergraduate students. Computer science is actually our #1 or #2 most minored program. And we make sure that the classes we offer keep up with demand.

Elton Lin: Got it, sounds good. So why don’t I invite Anthony back into the conversation, to help us moderate some of the questions? 

Anthony Su: We have a lot of questions about what you just talked about, majors and the application. One person asked, is there a difference between a student who’s applying undecided and one who’s already chosen a major, and how would you evaluate those two applications?

Matthew Gallery: I want to clarify, when you apply to BU we do have you indicate a “program of study.” We do have you at least choose a school or college. The reason we do that is because – as I think I mentioned early on – some of our schools and colleges have very specific requirements. If you’re applying to business or engineering, you need calculus. But you can apply undeclared business, or undeclared engineering, and declare your major when you’re in.

The reason we do this is that, once upon a time, BU did review by school or college. But because there’s so much flexibility for students to switch once they’re undergraduates here, we really wanted to level the playing field, and all across the board have the same application, with those small details that we do differently between programs.

And then, having a major versus not having a major, exactly zero difference!

Anthony Su: I think that makes sense. The other most popular question was from people who maybe couldn’t get a seat at a test this year, but they got one last year, and they didn’t score, in their eyes, particularly well. Should that person submit that older test score?

Matthew Gallery: Most schools don’t have a minimum. But what we do publish our middle 50 percentile. Now middle 50 percentile, for those who don’t know, is that, say I have 100 tests, I’m only going to talk about the middle 50. A quarter of these are going to be higher; a quarter are going to be lower. When your tests are lower than the middle 50 percentile, it means that you’re going to have to be “above” our averages in other areas. Maybe above a 3.8 GPA, have a very challenging curriculum, be heavily involved, have solid essays.

So it’s really something to ask yourself, whether you have ways to balance out those tests. I don’t want to give any specific advice, but hopefully having this context can help students make a better decision.

Anthony Su: Yes, I think that context is very important for parents and applicants.

Elton Lin: In this coming year, where it’s been very hard to take a test, it’s different than other years, when they might have been able to take a test more than once. So it’s understandable if they’re not submitting. 

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely.

Anthony Su: The next thing is kind of a multi-part question, so I’ll break it down. The first part is, how important is research in the admissions process?

Matthew Gallery: I assume we’re talking about completed research, or having been a part of research?

Anthony Su: Yeah.

Matthew Gallery: Again, we’re not looking for specific types of involvement. We’re going to have a fair number of students who were a part of research, but many who weren’t. Either by interest, or not having had access to it, especially with things like COVID going on. It’s about what you have been a part of. Many of our students get involved with undergraduate research, but not all of them come with that. So it’s not a be-all, end-all, by any means. But if you have been involved in research, it’s a good thing to include.

Anthony Su: You immediately talked about the second part of this question! Which was, if I had a research program lined up, and it was canceled, what if I took community college courses, or courses online, is that sufficient in demonstrating interest in that major or particular area of study?

Matthew Gallery: Yeah, I would say that definitely shows interest, and makes – sorry to use cliché terms – the best of a bad situation. They’re trying to do the best that they can and really set themselves up for success in those fields as well, so that’s something that’s going to be impressive within the application process.

Antony Su: We had some questions about pre-med as well. I’m guessing that a lot of students listening in are considering that, so they’re wondering, what are the requirements for math and science? And also, just, what’s the rigor of that program?

Matthew Gallery: It depends on which pre-med you’re talking about. BU has a couple of pre-med pathways. We have pre-med advising, which is where most students go through. It’s not a major at BU, so it’s an advising program.

We’ve actually had students go on from all but one of our schools and colleges to med school, including business and communication, even fine arts. So, regardless of your major you can have a pre-med adviser to assist you on the pathway to med school. So there’s no difference in the application process for pre-med advising.

We do offer a seven year accelerated program in medicine, and that program does have very specific requirements. It’s additional letters of recommendation, and additional essays. And really to be competitive for that program, students have a 4.0 – if not, a 3.9 – GPA, have exhausted the most competitive classes that are offered within their school, and have been heavily involved in the field of medicine, either through research, internships, shadowing, or clinical experience – those sorts of things.

Elton Lin: Would you say that that seven-year program is the most competitive program for you guys?

Matthew Gallery: Easily. 

Anthony Su: Yeah, another student was asking, were there any other joint B.A./M.A. programs? This student was interested in astrophysics.

Matthew Gallery: We do offer a number of what we call “accelerated” programs. They’re not programs that you apply into; they’re programs that you apply for either in your sophomore or your junior year. So there are a number of – I think they’re called four plus one programs, where in the fifth year you can earn your master’s. I’m not sure if there’s astrophysics specifically, but there are a good number of them, especially in our college of arts and sciences. But it’s something that you apply for down the road.

Anthony Su: Okay. We also had a personal question: was there an applicant who really stood out to you, whose story you still remember, and could you share that story?

Matthew Gallery: I’m going to try to keep it somewhat vague, to protect privacy, but… When I go through the process, I have the opportunity to meet so many folks. And what’s tough about that is I meet so many, so quickly, and then I retreat back into my cave, in Boston, for months at end, and I go over each application. But there are some times where I get to connect with students really through the whole process, and then I get to see them again, like if I get to visit California for a reception in the spring to just talk about whether BU’s going to be a good fit.

What stands out to me are students who are genuinely excited about just change, and a new way of life. Everything from, “I’m going to see snow for the first time!” to just this new atmosphere and community. It takes a desire to escape the “Bay Area bubble” which is funny because I say I escaped the Boston bubble! But it’s a nice opportunity to be able to connect with students in that regard.

As for memorable applications… There are always going to be the more difficult ones to read, students who’ve overcome adversity. I’m thinking of the Sonoma fires a couple of years ago – and really just all of California, especially in 2018. So folks who have overcome challenges and are still going through this process – that certainly stands out.

But there are also just students who’ve really put themselves fully out there. They have really interesting essays. There was one – and I won’t go too much into detail – that opened their essay with a shocker, describing the roles they’ve had in life, and they said they were a murderer, these terrible things… Then they talked about theater for the rest of the essay, and the roles they’d played.

Sometimes you just read a really fun students describe themselves, and that can sick with you!

Anthony Su: Then there was a student who was asking kind of the opposite question. What sorts of ideas or assumptions do you have about applicants before you read their essays? Is there anything that would help them to know about – any sort of pattern?

Matthew Gallery: Can you clarify what you mean by assumptions?

Anthony Su: I think this person was asking about test scores and GPA and extracurricular activities. What do you like to see? Basically, what not essay related could really help a student?

Matthew Gallery: I think we do a really good job at making sure that every piece counts. Personally, I make sure that I go through the rest of the application first before I get to the numbers. Numbers can really skew what you’re looking at for the rest of the application, and I want to get to know you first. I want to hear what you’re presenting to me, and how you would like to define yourself. Essays are a big part, but recommendation letters can also play a pivotal role in adding context. Those can give us pieces that students might not have known to share, or things they might not even have known about, that were happening in the background. Recommendations can be nice in adding that third party, to say who you are in the classroom, or in the community, how you come across to them, from all they’ve seen in their thirty plus years teaching. Those can add a nice contextual piece to the application. We just make sure we’re paying attention to everything, and not having assumptions based on just one measure.

Elton Lin: I think – if I’m looking at the same questions as Anthony, it’s more about, particularly, doing well in things like computer Olympiad, bio Olympiad, or other Olympiads. And certainly you see some students who’ve made it all the way down the pipeline, through these competitions. Does that really matter? Do those sorts of competitions really make a difference?

Matthew Gallery: Certainly. There are a couple of ways that students can present that in the application. There’s an awards section, where we often see things like National Merit Scholarship, or it might be things like class president, or other recognitions within the school. And there can also be independent awards or competitions. I see “eagle scout” there lots of times, or also robotics scholarships, or robotics competitions, things like that.

One thing that really shows us is a dedication to, and appreciation of, the thing they’re a part of. It shows that they’re sticking with it, long-term, and progressing in depth. And that is something we like to see.

Anthony Su: Yeah, and we have a follow-up to that question. Do strong extracurriculars help to balance out a low GPA or a low SAT score?

Matthew Gallery: Absolutely. Test scores are one thing that, if I could throw it out, I would, but unfortunately it’s not up to me. But stuff like this is what shapes more who you are.

And really, wherever you go to college, you’re going to want to have a full schedule. College is such a different atmosphere from high school. You’re only in class 15 hours a week. So you want to fill your time with clubs and organizations and other ways to be involved. So someone who’s involved currently really shows us that they have that balance.

And it adds a layer of context in terms of how they’re spending their time. If they’re working on that, and maybe also a job, or a lot of family responsibilities, it gives us context on why they didn’t have time to prep for those tests.

Anthony Su: On tossing out test scores – do you know if BU has considered going test-blind? What would be preventing that from happening? 

Matthew Gallery: I would say, if I were a betting man, it’s not going to be test-blind anytime soon. It would be a pretty big change on how we view test scores as a country. So, unfortunately, I don’t see us being test-blind anytime soon. But I do hope that it’s something we’ll consider, and I hope we’ll consider staying test-optional for many years, if not forever.

Anthony Su: Last few questions. There’s a question about merit scholarship applications. How is that evaluated? Is it different from the normal admissions process?

Matthew Gallery: There are a number of merit scholarships, but I’ll emphasize two because they’re the most prevalent. Those are the trustee scholarship and the presidential scholarship. Our trustee scholarship is a full tuition scholarship offered all four years, that doesn’t account for any rising cost in tuition, and our presidential scholarship is $25,000 for all four years.

The trustee scholarship does have an additional essay, and there are different prompts every year. But for presidential, there’s no difference. The only thing is that we do have a December first deadline for students who want to be considered for our merit-based scholarships. But a student could hypothetically apply and be considered for presidential without even knowing it. There’s no box they have to check, and no essay they have to write. But to be considered for trustee, there’s that extra essay.

Merit scholarships are not a large part of our financial aid budget – it’s actually less than 10% of our overall budget – so they are competitive. But test-optional also includes our merit scholarships. So a student doesn’t have to have tests to be considered for our merit scholarships. We’re just looking at the same applications we already have, to award those merit scholarships.

Elton Lin: And with regards to these scholarships, it there a preference for in-state or out-of-state students?

Matthew Gallery: No. There’s a significant breakdown. I always see, looking at my California students, quite a number who were offered the trustee scholarship. You know, like for the seven year medical program, we usually only take fifteen students, and there’s usually three or so from the Bay Area. Maybe that’s just indicative of the Bay Area, more than anything! But there’s no preference for or against in-state or out-of-state, or international.

Anthony Su: Related to international students and that medical program, there’s a question that asked if there are any restrictions on that program for international students. This person says that there was a restriction in the past. Is that correct?

Matthew Gallery: If there was a restriction, it hasn’t been during my time with BU. And I’m going on my fifth admissions cycle. If there was a restriction, it predates me. But for both med school advising, and the B.S./M.D., students have access to those programs regardless.

Elton Lin: International students regardless of where they’re from? Everyone has access to those programs?

Matthew Gallery: Mm-hmm. 

Anthony Su: We also had a question about going on from any other school into pre-med. One student, who played piano for ten plus years and now wants to be pre-med, wondered if there was an avenue there. Does the musical experience show commitment? 

Matthew Gallery: The precedent is there. We’ve had students go from fine arts. There really are no restrictions. What’s very interesting is that we had a talk with our pre-med advisers last year. And a trend that they like to see is students from different backgrounds. It’s a new way of thinking. It’s different perspectives. While biology and similar majors are awesome because they have so much of that pre-med curriculum built into them, students can still accomplish that pre-med curriculum regardless of the program that they’re studying.

Now, I’m not going to lie and say it’s going to be easy. They’re doing a full fine arts program, and they’re also doing heavy science coursework – laboratory experiences on top of performances. It’s certainly going to be a lot of work, but there’s precedent there. 

Anthony Su: Side question just for myself, because I’m interested: could students who are thinking about pre-med email the pre-med advisers? Is that information available online?

Matthew Gallery: Yes, and they can even indicate their interest in pre-med on the application. Really, it doesn’t play a role in the admissions review. All it does is, if a student chooses to enroll in BU, it makes sure they’re getting communication from our pre-med advisers, to start that process of working towards med school. Or, at least, makes sure they get the foundation, if they choose to go to med school. 

Elton Lin: Just to clarify, because this comes up a lot, pre-med is not a major. It’s more that the students are preparing, in the process of finishing their undergraduate degree, to go on and apply to med school, take the MCAT, and go through that whole process. So to be “pre-med” as an undergraduate, you can be, as you mentioned, a fine arts major, business major, whatever. In the end, they can all go on to med school, right?

Matthew Gallery: Every university’s going to be different, right? The way it works at BU is that you have your major adviser. Let’s say a student is bio, then they have a bio adviser. If they’re business, they have a business adviser. Then all of those students also have pre-med advisers. So they’ll have two folks they’ll be working with, not one.

Elton Lin: That’s a lot of advisers!

Matthew Gallery: They work together, and with the online portals, to make sure you’re taking the right classes. 

Elton Lin: Are there any more questions, Anthony? 

Anthony Su: There’s two more – can I squeeze them in?

Elton Lin: Squeeze them in!

Anthony Su: Perfect. Question about how you review students regionally: do you look at all the students from northern California, or do you look separately at each high school?

Matthew Gallery: It’s more that we’re looking at context within the school. It’s not like we’re comparing students, regardless of whether they’re from the same region or the same state, or even the same school. But we’re looking at what’s offered. So the school profile tells me what classes are offered at the school, and what types of curricula: AP versus IB versus, there’s so much more. And then if there are any restrictions on classes. That’s the biggest difference we’ll see across schools: how a student has challenged themselves based on what’s available. But, again, we have so many students applying from so many different schools, different countries, and different backgrounds, that it wouldn’t be fair to compare students against each other. So we are looking at the bigger picture in that regard.

Anthony Su: And then a question about those accelerated four-plus-one programs. Does that restrict studying abroad, or taking classes not related to the major?

Matthew Gallery: Students in the four-plus-one programs certainly can go abroad. Those are outside of pre-med, traditionally. In the seven year accelerated program in medicine, it’s certainly difficult. They would have to do a summer study-abroad program to be able to study abroad. It would not fit in the traditional three-year undergraduate study. 

Anthony Su: That’s definitely a little bit more restrictive, it sounds like.

Matthew Gallery: Mm-hmm.

Elton Lin: It’s just that the B.S./M.D. is so hyper-focused, and hyper-intensive, that there’s less room and space. 

Anthony Su: Yeah, and so many classes to take. Well, all right. That’ll wrap it up.

Elton Lin: All right. Well, thanks again Matthew for spending a solid hour with us. We covered a lot of content. And hopefully encouraged a lot of students, who maybe didn’t quite get the test scores they wanted, that maybe other parts of their application can balance it all out. I really appreciate your time.

And if you want to reach out to Matthew himself, his email is there. Hopefully you don’t get too many emails in your inbox from this! But, again, thank you so much. And good luck this coming season, with all the changes! 

Matthew Gallery: I really appreciate you both for hosting me tonight, and everyone who was able to participate. And definitely email me any questions. It’s a weird time, when it’s hard to get the information that you want. So fire away. 

Elton Lin: Great. Thanks again. And for those of you who are still here, not to compare with Matthew from BU, but we have Case Western coming on next week, a really terrific research university, so we’ll get to chat with them next week. Thank you again, Matthew. Really appreciate your time.

Matthew Gallery: You too.

Elton Lin: Okay, bye.

Matthew Gallery: Bye. 

Anthony Su: Bye.